This happens a lot... Someone decides to go on a quest, and sends a sending to everyone in Sanctuary asking for adventurers to come and join him. Several people come to his aid, and they immediately leave to perform the task.

This is not how a decent party should operate.

One of the things that annoys me the most in Escape from the Underdark is that most of the time, the party doesn't plan its spell tactics. Some are just too impatient to wait for the prepared spellcasters to prepare their spells, while others feel that it is metagaming to choose which spells to prepare based on the composition of the party.

Magic is everywhere in Toril. Unless you are a member of a reclusive race which is ignorant of magic, you will not be completely ignorant of how magic works. Yes, even if you have no ranks in Spellcraft.

The typical Torilian knows that there are different ways of using magic. He knows that some draw their power from nature, some from dieties, and some from the world itself. He knows that clerics and druids can heal, and that wizards and sorcerers can turn him into a toad.

He does not how Cure Light Wounds works, but he knows exactly what it can do. He does not know how Fireball works, but he knows that it is an effective siege weapon.

And if he is a member of an adventuring party which contains a spellcaster, he probably knows the names of some of the spellcaster's spells, and what they can do.

For example, in Keith Baker's novel, The Dreaming Dark Book 1: City of Towers, Daine, a fighter, orders Saerath, a wizard, to bring down an stormship once it gets in range. When it does get in range, Saerath then casts Dispel Magic ("EMP") at it, temporarily disrupting its elemental ring ("engine"). The stormship crashes before its elemental ring gets back online.

Daine has no idea how Dispel Magic works. He does know what it can do and what it can't do. He knows that it can disrupt magic, but he also knows that it has a maximum range.

How did he know this? Obviously, Saerath told him behind the scenes. It is important for Captain Daine to know what his subordinates can or can't do.

The three main prepared spellcasters are the most powerful classes in the game. This is because they have access to a very wide variety of spells.

However, their main drawback is that they have to prepare their spells in advance. They have to know ahead of time what spells to prepare, where to cast them, and when to cast them.

I prepare spells based on the composition of the party. Three melee combatants? I prepare three Magic Weapons (or three Greater Magic Weapons) and three Flame Weapons, and I tell the other spellcasters not to prepare these spells anymore. If the quest requires stealth, I prepare Invisibility. If there are too few melee combatants in the party, I prepare summoning spells.

Coordinating your prepared spells with the needs of your party is not metagaming. It is in-character, and it increases the party's chances of survival.

What do you think?

Vruuk thank you for the obvious information.

:idea:

I agree. This can be done well, and is a good example of RP for most spellcasters. Also - it greatly enhances the effectivness of the party in an IC/RP way.

This could be abused in a metagaming sense, but most of us should know better, right?

Good job on playing an effective member of your class!

Also - another outstanding example of a character playing his class came to me the other day. I had the pleasure of battling with a cleric in my party that did a great job of keeping the frontliners healed without breaking combat. Good job, Izrik!!

**Note - I realize that many spellcasters/clerics do not not play in either of the above fashions and are still great RPers, and are playing strictly IC. Please realize that I am not attacking anyone's style, just expressing excitement about these particular examples! Yay! Also - sorry for rambling and possibly taking the thread off-course.

1- That's something to work IG.

2- The metagame part is preparing spells according to what you OOCly know you will meet, and no the party composition; that is in no way metagaming.

3- No. Those people don't know what it does exactly. No spellcraft, they might know the obvious after they've seen it, or been told about it. A character with no spellcraft wouldn't know that cure light will not regenerate body parts or that it would damage undead. They have to be told.

good point.

I think people should prepare spells based on what's In-Character for them to prepare, and not what will gain them the most points in the quest.

If you have a problem with the way people prepare their spells, make a Sorcerer and lead by example.

I have to say to some level I agree, although I find this a little bit contradictory to your other post about running/walking.

I don't think most people on EfU would have any objections to a spellcaster considering the party make up and asking members of his party what they would like him to prepare (and co-ordinating with other spellcasters etc).

This obviously takes up more time than everyone just keeping the same stock-standard MW, Endure elements, bulls, endurance etc. BUT is immensely rewarding RP as well as overall of benefit to the party. So in your other thread you argue for saving time, and this thread to take more time. But meh. Good for you for posting your thoughts.

As others have noted, its when you prepare spells with an OOC knowledge of a quest in mind that people would frown on it. This is basically ANY information you would not know from speaking to the quest giver.

I think that some good points were made, among them, that an experienced caster should know his art just as an experienced fighter should know something of tactics and advantagous fighting. I agree, though to a limit.

The statement:

This is not how a decent party should operate.

It caught my interest.

If you mean decent in the meaning of a PC taking charge of a group and using some strong tactics to overcome a problem, then great. I agree. Though said leader certainly should have the in game and in character experience, knowledge, and certainly skills (persuade/intimidate) and of course charisma to back up his expert leadership abilities. I see nothing wrong with an experienced and well battled fighter who can't lead, because he's got no ability to. Will the "party" suffer for his lack of leadership? Yes. But, if you wanted a leader, you should have put skill points into the social skills and points into cha. Same goes for a mage, cleric, etc. And for a mage with low/normal wisdom, likely he is in character not being so well prepared.

The party will suffer due to peole actually playing their characters as they should, especially when you just pull a group together for a one time adventure. There should, in my opinion, be tension if you take a good and an evil guy along. Or a warrior of Bane and a Cleric of Tyr (I have seen plenty of this happen). And usually on the quest it all gets shut off, the Tyrran healing the Banite warrior, etc, and after it's all over and the pay is dished out thenthe rp starts again and the Tyrran stalks off the the Banite *smirks* under his evil black helm.

Personally I enjoy parties with the tension and rp in the adventure that causes it to flub up the tactics. It makes a repetative quest interesting, and we are here, after all, not for WoW timing perfection but for the interaction and the fun actually playing a character brings.

As for the pre-planning with spell memorization, I'm all for it. So long as the planning is supported by the character stats, experience, etc. (ie, so long as it is in character). My spell casters usually have a pre-determined set of spells they roll with because that is what I as the player, would see them memorizing. Do I tweek it? Sometimes. But usually not much.

chezcaliente I have to say to some level I agree, although I find this a little bit contradictory to your other post about running/walking.

As I said, I am half-powergamer and half-roleplayer. My thread about running leaned more towards my powergaming side, while this thread leans more towards my roleplaying side.

What can I say? I'm a centrist. :D

I'm all for people sitting down and an inn and discussing tactics IC based on IC information. I encourage it a lot for some quests (others might be time sensitive). It's a good RP opportunity instead of just seeing how fast you can spam quests. Making each quest bigger than just running through QA areas will keep them fun.

tactics are good for wizards in party. but i noticed this issue. rouges can do overwhelmind damgae when used correctly. fight and barbarians can maintain long based combat fighting. clerics are good in the second line since there fighter/ healing. bards are useful for any class due to there song. wizards and sorcerors can do overwhelming damage or be super effective in the third line. rangers make excellent archers. druids have good offensive and defensive abilities as well as spells though yuo do not get many spells slots. i wouldn't know where to place adruid in game.

so if you lack a class where it may end up saving you skin it is a descent idea to have at least one bard in you party. 2 fighters or barbarians. one wizard or sorceror. 1 cleric. druids are optional period unless the quest absolutely call for it. rangers are recommended and rouges....well if your fighhting undead do not bother bringing them along.

for paladins, there to restricting for my tastes you couldn't get a paladin to go along with an evil person even if the the world was about to end

I'm not going to penalise anyone for metagaming spellsets, but it'd be nice to see people not metagame their spellsets.

Bards and Sorcerers. Then the DMs know you can't metagame your spellsets

To put a mild twist on an old phrase, we're flaggelating the expired equine here.