Dwarves

[RIPnogarD]

Just my not so humble opinion, but I think DM's should keep an eye out for dwarves that don't follow the Morndinsamman way. Of course I'm talking about those that actually claim too, not those who don't. But if they call themselves dwarf and use dwarven lineage type names and claim clans and a Morndinsamman god then they should heed other dwarves over ANY others. They should be willing to stop whatever they are doing to talk to each-other. And they should NEVER claim "mate" with a human over another of the dwarf that they never talked to. I've seen quite a few so-called dwarves IG/IC doing exactly this. Pretending to RP with a "[passing nod]" to a dwarf while running off with non-dwarves or by themselves. Not going to get into details due to one or two of the four or five dwarves I've attempted to talk to may actually have a real reason (like not care about the Morndinsamman) to not associate with another dwarf. But I'd be willing to bet a give odds that two or three of them have no excuse except NOT playing a dwarf as a Morndinsamman. I've had only one other dwarf that bothered to do a quest and bother to talk a bit with a my dwarf PC besides in passing "Oh, hello kin... Sorry, I have to (do X), bye!" Plain and simple, no debating it, this is just wrong!

Personally I don't care if people have issues with me or my playing style. But if those dwarves are doing that same thing to other dwarves or gathering with them and jilting me then those players and or PC should be delt with. Have Moradin make their beards fall off or something ffs.

//[COLOR="Red"]Stands back and waits to see who the players of the NON-Morndinsamman dwarves are by their posts saying Morndinsamman shouldn't have to put other dwarves first and foremost on their priority list![/COLOR]

[Disco]

IMO we should let players play their own characters, not dictates how they are to play them.

[RIPnogarD]

IMO we should let players play their own characters, not dictates how they are to play them.

I agree, but if you don't want to play a dwarf then pick another race.

edit:
Ok... I should have said if you pick a Morndinsamman god then play the PC as a Morndinsamman!

[Luke Danger]

I'm with Disco, though don't forget, sometimes it might be a legit case. With Gloin, he tried to put his kin first, but sometimes prior obligations got in the way, but he always found the kin later and caught up with his duties to his people.

Dwarves are a challange. If a dwarf is a loner to even his own kin, then so be it. If he's just poorly played, well, you get that everywhere. Just suck it up IMO.

Edit: However, what I -REALLY- hate is that some people pick other races then play them like a human with a different appearance and base stats.

[TheImpossibleDream]

Go fuck yourself, kin.

Edit:

Joking aside. Handle it IG and IC. Approach dwarves with your concerns. Who knows you might find out the way you ic'ly approached it thus far has been offensive to some.

[RIPnogarD]

I'm not dictating this rule. There is NO Morndinsamman god that doesn't dictate clan and kin over all else. There is only one that even comes close and his says that Morndinsamman are still to be put over all others.

As I said in the OP, if they (a dwarf) are NOT Morndinsamman that's cool. But DM's should watch for and deal with those that calim Morndinsamman and don't follow the cland & kin rule dictated by their god.

[Ebok]

Relax. Chill out. Dwarf "mobs" are bad for business, mixing things up are good for some people. A dwarf following Moradin might actually only be concerned about his clan of dwarf, whom non of which are here, therefore sticks to the people he's already got some ground in. This is fine.

Dwarves are under no divine restriction to love other dwarves. Even ones faithful to the pantheon.

[TheImpossibleDream]

Only priests follow the dogma strictly. Dwarves are usually courteous to other dwarves due to traditions.

In fact I would go as far to say your dwarves methods are somewhat undwarf like. But I'd much prefer to handle that ic'ly. Stop whining ooc over ic stuff and start whining ic and you might see some results or at least figure out what you're doing wrong.

[Skrillix]

Haela Brightaxe, Vergadain and Dugmaren Brightmantle do not put clan and kin over all else, according to the linked dogmas, not that non-divine characters are bound incredibly closely to them in the first place.

[RIPnogarD]

If you're catholic, your catholic, you don't have to be a priest to follow the ten commandments. And if you don't follow them what happens? I think it says you don't get into heaven. If you're Morndinsamman, you don't have to be a priest to listen to, believe in and follow what the priests you were raised to treat as you would Moradin himself dictate. If you claim a Morndinsamman god you would have been raised with this system and would fear becoming banned (clanless) and nameless for your discretions.

[Barehander]

Putting clan and kin first and foremost doesn't necessarily mean stopping to socialize with every dwarf out there. I doubt that's what any dwarven deity expects. A dwarf who's got a job to do wouldn't stop to chat about the weather with every stump he passed on the way. It's not as if dwarves are a rarity in the colony.

Elitism makes me want to do the exact opposite of what's expected, and anyone telling me how to play awakens the rebel in me. Neither DMs nor anyone else have any right to "keep an eye on" or do something about how you play your character; apart from IC intervention. If you're a player, your PC can bring it up. If you're a DM, and it's appropriate, a divine messenger can intervene. It's never an OOC issue. Even when a cleric is grossly misinterpreting his patron's dogma, it's perfectly IC and must not be corrected OOC. Instead, he will face IC consequences: falling from grace, banishment from the church, the scorn of his fellows or whatever.

[RIPnogarD]

Putting clan and kin first and foremost doesn't necessarily mean stopping to socialize with every dwarf out there. I doubt that's what any dwarven deity expects. A dwarf who's got a job to do wouldn't stop to chat about the weather with every stump he passed on the way. It's not as if dwarves are a rarity in the colony.

In any non-EFU:A setting, where the dwarf is part of a clan and there are other dwarven clans around I would agree with this.

In EFU:A... Nope, can't agree. One way or another, been on Ymph long time or short, this is the best time to show your dwarven spirit. New would want to find the local clan and seek help. Old would realise there was no local clan and either try to make one or in the least make an EXTRA effort to find out about and help those newly displaced kin. They would NEVER, [Nods in passing], a dwarf they never seen before.

Elitism makes me want to do the exact opposite of what's expected, and anyone telling me how to play awakens the rebel in me. Neither DMs nor anyone else have any right to "keep an eye on" or do something about how you play your character; apart from IC intervention. If you're a player, your PC can bring it up. If you're a DM, and it's appropriate, a divine messenger can intervene. It's never an OOC issue. Even when a cleric is grossly misinterpreting his patron's dogma, it's perfectly IC and must not be corrected OOC. Instead, he will face IC consequences: falling from grace, banishment from the church, the scorn of his fellows or whatever.

Yeah, I kinda dislike elitism too, oh wait, perhaps I should refrase that.. Neither DMs nor anyone else have any right to "keep an eye on" or do something about how you play your character. Oh wait, thats what you said... I see an elitest loop here someplace. Hmm.. Maybe I should say, people who live in glass houses should throw stones.

[TheImpossibleDream]

Barehand has it.

Also just because you're a cleric pc does not make you special in the eyes of dwarves. It seems to me like you picked cleric thinking all dwarf pc's must lick clerical boot and be all hugs and kisses with you or something.

[Equinox]

"Wah wah, I want instant respect from my IG race, and If i dont get it without minimal effort I will make a rant on the forums and blame everyone else"

Thats how I read the OP.

Stop bitching and demanding this and that. deal with it IG.

[Barehander]

I think you exaggerate, though I get your point. It applies to all demihumans, really: they are a minority in a human environment, and would probably like to stick together.

But it's not as if they are biologically defined by their love for kin. These are cultural stereotypes, and surely no more compelling than any stereotypes you'd have about human societies. Not all Reformed Protestants are hard-working capitalists, not all Japanese revere their elders, not all Finns are socially inept drunkards.

My dwarf (which you met) is a travelling priest of Dugmaren Brightmantle who's lived the recent decades in Silverymoon with elves, humans and everything imaginable. He appreciates his heritage and the kinship of other dwarves, but he doesn't find them very interesting. He is not going to discover and learn something new by stopping to chit-chat with a random dwarf when there is great adventure to be had. Certainly he'll take the dwarven side in a fight, but such profound ideals and values only come up in dire circumstances. Theologically, all Christians are brothers and sisters and should share in faith, but you don't see 80% of the population walking hand in hand and helping eachother on the streets, either.

We play adventurers. No matter your upbringing, I think adventure is more pressing and interesting than stopping to talk about the weather with a stranger. You can talk any time, but adventure waits for no dwarf!