Tracking!

[illuminaughty]

Okay, so we're all aware that tracking is pretty much the coolest thing since sliced bread. It has recently come to my attention that it has been disabled for use against players.

I heard that it was being 'spammed'? Confirm/deny?

My thoughts are this:

It probably was being spammed, but then again.. How else are you going to track things? If my track says go 60 meters north.. and I do, and I don't see anything.. You can bet your buttons I'm going to track again.. And again, and again until I find my quarry. I was under the impression that this is how things got done! So, why is it different when a player comes into the mix?

So then, I figure this comes down to one of two things.. Is it a balance issue, or a lag issue? If it's a lag issue, it might be worth enabling again with the new server.. Or perhaps, just enabled for a few individuals to see if it really affects anything (me, me! Pick me!)

If it's a balance issue, then I think we should talk about it. Currently if someone runs into the woods you have about a 5% chance of finding them, maybe. If you're lucky. I think that having tracker PC's makes for a fun hunt.. I know that recently I've gone on several man-hunts that were completely boring and ended up with no one finding anything, because it's pretty much just a stab in the dark. I don't think that's particularly fun, or fair. It's not like tracking will be 100% ranger homing missile on your ass.. It still requires some effort and foresight. There are also skill checks involved that further balance it out. If people were spamming the command to get around the skill checks, then maybe a cool-down timer would be appropriate.

My last plea is this, if tracking is way too dangerous and powerful for use against PCs, how about at least allowing a ranger to track his FA's if a PC happens to be that race. Say, a ranger whose FA is elves, can track elf pc's. I think this at the very least would be appropriate and would allow bounty hunters to exist.

[Mort]

No. It was used as a PvP Radar, Illum. It informed you whenever someone stealthed, invisible/or normal entered the area you were in and that wasn't cool.

With a DM you can certainly track others, and we'll supervise manhunt in these ways if there are characters capable of tracking. But it's just one of these features that was needed to be removed (sadly) because people wouldn't use it as it was meant to be used.

[BrittanyPanthas]

I brought this up a while back, and I think it would be beneficial if tracking was reenabled against players, but did not distinguish between race, nor give a person's name.  Instead, it would simply state: 'A medium sized creature X distance in this direction' assuming you make all the checks.

Disabling it in 'civilized' settings would also be a nice solution.

[Snoteye]

[Howl] The problem is that you, as a ranger, can sit in one corner of the map, and just spam the tracking, and if a PC should enter the entirely opposite side of the map, you will then know about it
[Howl] A good tracking system that actually let PCs track other PCs would be awesome
[Howl] But it isn't good as like - a radar

[Snoteye] It's also impossible to implement in a feasible way.
[Snoteye] It can only be done by creating track objects, that will invariably lead to lag.

[Howl] Well, imagine this. You are waiting in ambush for someone. There are no NPcs in the area. You just sit there tracking, and then when someone comes, you know it's time to IC'ly tell your party to buff up and get ready to ambush.
[Howl] And you know (somehow) from all the way across the map, that this PC has entered the map

[Mort] (This has happened)

[I can has fun?]

Alternatively, it is also possible to track a PC though role play. I have done this many times. It can be tricky to pull off sometimes, but it is entirely possible.

It's a simple matter of either having good spies or being one yourself. If you want to hunt someone down, all you need is foreknowledge of a place where they will be and the approximate time they will be there. That should give you time to cover the escape routes and prepare a good ambush.

[illuminaughty]

Oh.

Hm..

I suppose I am verily defeated. Le sigh.

[Thomas_Not_very_wise]

No. It was used as a PvP Radar, Illum. It informed you whenever someone stealthed, invisible/or normal entered the area you were in and that wasn't cool.

With a DM you can certainly track others, and we'll supervise manhunt in these ways if there are characters capable of tracking. But it's just one of these features that was needed to be removed (sadly) because people wouldn't use it as it was meant to be used.

,...

DM's can help you track? I remember a certain DM telling me you cannot track PC's, period.

[9lives]

If we are so inclined, yes.

[MrGrendel]

Well, maybe not perfect, but (assuming someone actually wanted to make it work for players, and be as close to realistic as possible) how about..
 
 
 
1. A tool to set your player tracking target with. A DM can set your target if they're not in the area, but you have a good reason to follow someone's tracks. (Away from the scene of a crime, for instance.) It doesn't return a name and you can only set one at a time.
 
2. Use the distance script in tracking to only give you a result if the target is moving away from you over the X seconds of tracking. In other words, you can't track them if they're heading towards or around you, or sitting still.
 
 
 
This would allow you to track players you've actually seen and thus would know what their tracks look like, and are actually moving away from you - ie you started by looking at their tracks, and are in an area where they probably have actually left tracks.
 
You could also start just by looking at tracks somewhere, if a DM will set your player target for you. The tracking script would do the rest. Ideally, it would not actually tell you the name when you track in this manner... just "Your chosen target" etc.
 
And lastly, if you haven't made a successful tracking check on your target in a certain amount of time, perhaps an hour, it should clear it out - you simply lost the trail.

[kanrath]

Any player realy interested in getting tracking back may want to hop around both the NWN forums  and some servers, Ive been on a couple that would only track within a specific area of range. If you find one peraps the dms will consider adding it if its not a couple hundered coding lines long and is lagless

[Sr.N]

[Snoteye] It can only be done by creating track objects, that will invariably lead to lag.

How bad is to add a few 'Tracks' placeables that rangers can click on and get Info on who passed there recently? In addition with triggers that store in the Tracks 'placeable' who recently passed through.
Too ugly performance-wise?

[Cruzel]

Sr. N, that can get -very- ugly, performance wise.


But based on Grendel's suggestion using a playertool, I might be able to come up with an alternative which would be closer to real tracking, if the DMs want it.

My way of handling would be different from the current system, and not be able to be used as a radar. It will not work well against monsters, but against PCs for tracking for PVP wise, I think I could make this viable, yet keep it fun and unexploitable.

[Snoteye]

How bad is to add a few 'Tracks' placeables that rangers can click on and get Info on who passed there recently?

Oh, you have no idea.

How badly we want a solution for tracking PCs is something somebody who spends more time in the client can comment on.

[Dilandau Kale]

Not sure if its possible but how about tying track directly into either the search or spot skill? Basically when you track you make a dc check (something like base of 15 plus if possible opponents hide) to find them if you fail you cant do it again (in the same way if you fail a lore check on certain quests you cant just spam lore till you get it right).

[Snoteye]

We can't do that, but it was essentially how tracking worked when it was enabled for PCs anyway.